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 Post subject: German Fighters V6.2
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:07 pm 
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Fokker E.II 23.61
Fokker E.III 18.23
Halberstad D.II 26.20
Fokker D.I 24.95
Albatross D.I 28.56
Fokker D.III 29.66
Pfalz D.III 31.46
Albatross D.II 32.90
Albatross D.III 32.70
Albatross D.V 32.90
Fokker Dr.I 35.02
Halberstadt CL.II 24.09
Roland D.VI 34.72
Fokker D.VII/MIII 33.28
Fokker D.VII/MIIIa 34.45
Fokker D.VII/BMW 38.39
Halberstadt CL.IV 26.82
Pfalz D.VIII 30.77
Pfalz D.XII 34.64
Siemens D.III 33.53
Siemens D.IV 30.35
Fokker D.VIII 24.37
Junkers D.1 29.54
Ar-65 36.52
He-51 45.92
Ar-68 42.49
Me-109B 48.60
Me-109C 50.69
Me-109D 56.80
Me-109E-1 61.91
Me-109E-1a 67.73
Me-109E-2 61.69
Me-109E-2a 67.49
Me-109E-3 75.70
Me-109E-4 82.10
Me-109E4/N 84.90
Me-109E-7 85.89
Me-109T-1 83.03
Me-109F-1 84.23
Me-109F-2 85.23
Me-109F-4 90.90
Me-109F-4/R1 94.87
Me-109G-1 91.88
Me-109G-5 96.33
Me-109G-6 102.33
Me-109G-6/R2 101.52
Me-109G-6/R4 113.39
Me-109G-6/R6 101.82
Me-109K-4 125.90
He-112B-1 62.81
Me-110B-1 62.80
Me-110C-1 67.96
Me-110C-4 71.16
Me-110D-2 72.65
Me-110E 83.59
Me-110F-2 94.15
Me-110F-4 92.46
Me-110F-4/NJ 121.79
Me-110G-2 87.07
Me-110G-4 109.27
Me-110G-4r 114.37
Ju-88C-2 87.56
Ju-88C-4 91.20
Ju-88C-6 117.10
Ju-88G-7 131.55
Do-17Z-10 70.46
Do-217J-1 85.14
Do-217N-1 105.12
Me-210 100.51
Me-410A-1 104.01
He-100D-0 84.36
FW-190A-2 106.93
FW-190A-4 118.73
FW-190A-6 124.23
FW-190A-6/R1 128.55
FW-190A-6/R6 128.32
FW-190A-8 126.03
FW-190F-3 100.17
FW-190D-9 117.15
FW-190D-12 124.95
FW-190D-14 124.88
Ta-152C-1 137.98
Ta-152H-1 120.93
He-219A-5/R-1 142.95
He-219A-5/R-2 130.95
He-219A-5/R-3 143.55
Do-335A-1 129.14
Do-335A-6 131.92
Do-335B-1 155.54
He-280A-1 134.91
Me-262A 167.85
Me-262A/R4M 171.42
Me-163B-1 161.10
Me-163C-1 157.54
He-162A-2 145.23
Ba-349A-0 135.50

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2015 10:36 pm 
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Is the Ba-349 lethality figure with respect to Allied bombers, or its own freakin' pilots? :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2015 3:25 pm 
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Why an almost ten point drop between the Fokker D.VII and the Fokker D.VIII/E.VIII?

Can we get engine variants for the D.VII? (this also applies to the Camel)

And where would the Austro-Hungarian fighters go?

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2015 7:59 pm 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
Why an almost ten point drop between the Fokker D.VII and the Fokker D.VIII/E.VIII?

Much less engine power and structurally very weak.

Quote:
Can we get engine variants for the D.VII? (this also applies to the Camel)


I might do that as a separate sub-table. The major thing is to get the main types done first.

Quote:
And where would the Austro-Hungarian fighters go?


In the "others" table. AFAIK there are only two of them

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2015 8:01 pm 
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Poohbah wrote:
Is the Ba-349 lethality figure with respect to Allied bombers, or its own freakin' pilots? :lol:


I believe that was a subject of spirited debate in the Luftwaffe.

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2015 8:25 pm 
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Francis Urquhart wrote:
Johnnie Lyle wrote:
Why an almost ten point drop between the Fokker D.VII and the Fokker D.VIII/E.VIII?

Much less engine power and structurally very weak.

Quote:
Can we get engine variants for the D.VII? (this also applies to the Camel)


I might do that as a separate sub-table. The major thing is to get the main types done first.


It would be interesting, or to include them as separate entries. The D.VII had at least three different (Mercedes D.III, Mercedes D.IIIaü. and BMW), which had serious performance differences. Same with the Camels and the Clergeaut.

Quote:
And where would the Austro-Hungarian fighters go?


In the "others" table. AFAIK there are only two of them[/quote]

There were least six, the Phonix D.I-D.III, Hansa-Brandenburg D.I, and Aviatik-Berg (Aviatik) D-I. They also produced Abatross D.IIIs under licence, but changed them a bit, mostly in the armament.

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:01 pm 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
It would be interesting, or to include them as separate entries. The D.VII had at least three different (Mercedes D.III, Mercedes D.IIIaü. and BMW), which had serious performance differences. Same with the Camels and the Clergeaut.


Probably something I'll go back and do once I've got everything in

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There were least six, the Phonix D.I-D.III, Hansa-Brandenburg D.I, and Aviatik-Berg (Aviatik) D-I. They also produced Abatross D.IIIs under licence, but changed them a bit, mostly in the armament.


The Phonix D1 and DIII were built in quantity, I don't think the DII was built in enough numbers or differed enough from the DI to warrant an entry. I'll put the DIII and the H-B in.

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.2
PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 11:40 am 
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Can you add the Halberstadt CL.II (escort fighter), Halberstadt CL.IV (as a night fighter), Pfalz D.VIII and Siemens-Schuckert D.III?

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.2
PostPosted: Tue Sep 15, 2015 12:33 pm 
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All done

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 4:50 pm 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
It would be interesting, or to include them as separate entries. The D.VII had at least three different (Mercedes D.III, Mercedes D.IIIaü. and BMW), which had serious performance differences. Same with the Camels and the Clergeaut.


OK, they're in. Camel with 130, 140 and 150 hp engines, the DVII with 160, 185 and 240 hp (the latter rating destroyed the engine establishing a long German tradition).

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 5:00 pm 
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Frank Underwood wrote:
Johnnie Lyle wrote:
It would be interesting, or to include them as separate entries. The D.VII had at least three different (Mercedes D.III, Mercedes D.IIIaü. and BMW), which had serious performance differences. Same with the Camels and the Clergeaut.


OK, they're in. Camel with 130, 140 and 150 hp engines, the DVII with 160, 185 and 240 hp (the latter rating destroyed the engine establishing a long German tradition).


You can readily see why pilots preferred the BMW engine in the Fokker DVII!

I assume the Camel 2F1 in the RN list is armed with 1 Vickers and 1 Lewis on a Foster mount? Can we get a rating on the "Comic" vs the standard F.1, or does going from twin Vickers to twin Lewis not really matter that much?

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 5:10 pm 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
You can readily see why pilots preferred the BMW engine in the Fokker DVII!


And why the 140hp Camel wasn't popular. That engine was heavy.

Quote:
I assume the Camel 2F1 in the RN list is armed with 1 Vickers and 1 Lewis on a Foster mount? Can we get a rating on the "Comic" vs the standard F.1, or does going from twin Vickers to twin Lewis not really matter that much?

Comic applied to several British nightfighters including a single-seat conversion of the one-and-a-half strutter. I haven't got details for any of them I'm afraid; they actually differed significantly from the originals.

The over-wing Lewis gun is actually a lot more effective that a single synchronized Vickers (about 50 percent better). Its interesting that the Lewis/Vickers combo was preferred to twin Vickers guns.

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 7:12 pm 
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Francis Urquhart wrote:
The over-wing Lewis gun is actually a lot more effective that a single synchronized Vickers (about 50 percent better). Its interesting that the Lewis/Vickers combo was preferred to twin Vickers guns.


That Foster mount gives you a much wider arc of fire in the vertical - Albert Ball in particular liked the mount for that reason, because it allowed you to avoid the tail gunner on a two seater. That may well be why it was incorporated on the SE5. Ball wanted twin Lewis' on a Foster mount for the A.F.B.1, though it ended up with a Vickers MG in the propeller shaft, and an overwing Lewis.

It also makes getting to the drum and firing mechanism a lot easier, which made changing drums much less dangerous.

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 Post subject: Re: German Fighters V6.1
PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 9:04 am 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
That Foster mount gives you a much wider arc of fire in the vertical - Albert Ball in particular liked the mount for that reason, because it allowed you to avoid the tail gunner on a two seater. That may well be why it was incorporated on the SE5. Ball wanted twin Lewis' on a Foster mount for the A.F.B.1, though it ended up with a Vickers MG in the propeller shaft, and an overwing Lewis.


The Lewis also fired faster (especially when on the upper wing and thus clear of the propeller arc) and was lighter - no small thing when we're dealing with aircraft weights this low. I get a strong feeling that the better a shot the pilot was, the greater his preference for Lewis guns.

Quote:
It also makes getting to the drum and firing mechanism a lot easier, which made changing drums much less dangerous.


And clearing jams of course. Changing a drum magazine was the great drawback of the Lewis Gun although the fact that magazine made the weapon a self-contained package was a plus.

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