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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2017 7:03 pm 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
drunknsubmrnr wrote:
Just so you know, party poppers are something totally different over here.

I hope Rob is drinking something when he reads this.

You're not supposed to tell him that until after he's been mocked mercilessly.

Buzzkill.


You're harshing my mellow.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 03, 2017 11:14 am 
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Well I survived.
It was pretty fun and educational, clearing buildings room by room with gunfire and handgrenades and all that. Advancing and then combat in city environments.

Trying to keep up with 18-19 year olds that just left basic, not so fun! (Pain everywhere :P )
On the plus side they'd just exercised this so I just observed closely and tried to do what they did. :lol:

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:10 am 
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drunknsubmrnr wrote:
Johnnie Lyle wrote:
drunknsubmrnr wrote:
Just so you know, party poppers are something totally different over here.

I hope Rob is drinking something when he reads this.

You're not supposed to tell him that until after he's been mocked mercilessly.

Buzzkill.


You're harshing my mellow.

Have some mayo.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2017 2:01 pm 
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Actually I should add one thing, I wore the Hanwag Special Forces GTx that Phil recommended earlier and they were worth their weight in gold doing this sort of thing.
Not sure all of me would have stayed in one piece without them, so thanks again! :D

As an side I've ordered the Altberg Norway MkII for winter use now, will be interesting to see how they are.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:43 am 
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Some public photos, me on the right hand side here. I look the exact opposite of cool. :lol:
Image

Other photos, not featuring your hero ;) :
Image

Image

Image

Image

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:52 am 
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You have that "back in MY day, we used to shoot DANES, not these newfangled Russkie things . . . " look.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2017 12:09 pm 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
You have that "back in MY day, we used to shoot DANES, not these newfangled Russkie things . . . " look.

I'll take that as a complement. :D

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 8:47 am 
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Keep your eyes on a swivel, have the entire squad cover all sides and elevations, and employ cover where ever you can. The aim isn't for you to die for your country, its for the other sod to die for his!

Ammo is cheaper than human lives. If your rifle has a "family" setting, use it to fire controlled bursts at the target when clearing rooms. Also, dependant on ROE, hand grenades, hand grenades, hand grenades. Oh, did I mention hand grenades?


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 10:53 am 
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Thanks! I'm not sure if I dare ask how a submariner knows this much about urban combat. :D

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 12:26 pm 
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Micael wrote:
Thanks! I'm not sure if I dare ask how a submariner knows this much about urban combat. :D

Shore leave.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 15, 2017 12:37 pm 
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So true. I left out how to joust with forklifts, it didn't seem to apply.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:03 pm 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
Micael wrote:
Thanks! I'm not sure if I dare ask how a submariner knows this much about urban combat. :D

Shore leave.

This.

Also, was on the QRF/Self-Defence Squad on the surface ship I served on before going under water. We were trained in how to fight in urban areas in case we had to secure a harbour area before the ship put in, as well as fighting in confined quarters in the event of boarding or stuff. Handling the AG3 (AK4 for you Micael) in confined quarters is... not recommended. Makes for ruddy big holes in the targets tho :)


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 3:12 pm 
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Eeo wrote:
Johnnie Lyle wrote:
Micael wrote:
Thanks! I'm not sure if I dare ask how a submariner knows this much about urban combat. :D

Shore leave.

This.

Also, was on the QRF/Self-Defence Squad on the surface ship I served on before going under water. We were trained in how to fight in urban areas in case we had to secure a harbour area before the ship put in, as well as fighting in confined quarters in the event of boarding or stuff. Handling the AG3 (AK4 for you Micael) in confined quarters is... not recommended. Makes for ruddy big holes in the targets tho :)

Aha.
Yeah the AG3/AK4 isn't exactly the most convenient rifle in a confined space. Don't you guys use the MP-5 pretty extensively as well? That should be convenient aboard a ship I would imagine.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 3:31 pm 
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Real naval boarding parties use cutlasses!


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 3:50 pm 
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David Newton wrote:
Real naval boarding parties use cutlasses!


Those are pretty awkward in close quarters. Because the compartments are more or less linear, boarding pikes might actually make sense.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 4:15 pm 
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edgeplay_cgo wrote:
Those are pretty awkward in close quarters. Because the compartments are more or less linear, boarding pikes might actually make sense.

Getting through hatches with a boarding pike may be difficult. Based on experience in the days of sail though, boarding actions very rarely went below decks. Normally, the action was over if the boarders seized the quarterdeck and in the few cases when it wasn't, seizing the main deck was enough. People below deck would surrender once that had been achieved. Simple reason why, the boarding party would threaten to spread gunpowder on the decks and set the ship on fire if they didn't. That's why we read so often of ships complements of several hundred men surrendering to a few dozen boarders.

Pistols do seem to be the ideal took to fighting below decks. Handy, rapid fire, can carry plenty of ammunition etc.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 5:35 pm 
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Francis Urquhart wrote:
edgeplay_cgo wrote:
Those are pretty awkward in close quarters. Because the compartments are more or less linear, boarding pikes might actually make sense.

Getting through hatches with a boarding pike may be difficult. Based on experience in the days of sail though, boarding actions very rarely went below decks. Normally, the action was over if the boarders seized the quarterdeck and in the few cases when it wasn't, seizing the main deck was enough. People below deck would surrender once that had been achieved. Simple reason why, the boarding party would threaten to spread gunpowder on the decks and set the ship on fire if they didn't. That's why we read so often of ships complements of several hundred men surrendering to a few dozen boarders.

Pistols do seem to be the ideal took to fighting below decks. Handy, rapid fire, can carry plenty of ammunition etc.

I suspect it's less about blowing the deck, and more the lack of access. The hatchways would be killing grounds.

If anything, blowing the decks would be more detrimental to the boarders, if Tromp's experience is anything to go by.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 7:31 pm 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
I suspect it's less about blowing the deck, and more the lack of access. The hatchways would be killing grounds. If anything, blowing the decks would be more detrimental to the boarders, if Tromp's experience is anything to go by.

Not blowing so much as burning. Uncontained gunpowder isn't explosive but it is a good fire accelerant. It's mentioned in one of the Napoleonic Frigate books I got that "surrender or we'll burn the ship" was a standard threat if the below-decks crew didn't surrender. So much so that it was understood and usually didn't have to be explicitly made. I would have thought that being trapped below decks in a burning wooden ship is horrifying enough to make anybody surrender. I have a description in one case of a ship that had been boarded that the below-decks crew were going out the gunports rather than face the possibility the ship might be fired.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 4:58 am 
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Francis Urquhart wrote:
Johnnie Lyle wrote:
I suspect it's less about blowing the deck, and more the lack of access. The hatchways would be killing grounds. If anything, blowing the decks would be more detrimental to the boarders, if Tromp's experience is anything to go by.

Not blowing so much as burning. Uncontained gunpowder isn't explosive but it is a good fire accelerant. It's mentioned in one of the Napoleonic Frigate books I got that "surrender or we'll burn the ship" was a standard threat if the below-decks crew didn't surrender. So much so that it was understood and usually didn't have to be explicitly made. I would have thought that being trapped below decks in a burning wooden ship is horrifying enough to make anybody surrender. I have a description in one case of a ship that had been boarded that the below-decks crew were going out the gunports rather than face the possibility the ship might be fired.


Two things...

Firstly, deck captured- the captors simply run a couple of carronades up to the hatches (3-4) loaded with grape. The only thing the crew below decks can do is to cut the tiller cords. So, threat to captors is low. That leads to...

Secondly, deck captured. Rising above deck is around 400' of masts combined, 3500sq ft of canvas and 30 miles of tarred rigging. Scattering powder and burning the deck doesn't even need to come into it. Firing the rigging will doom a wooden man o' war within a couple of minutes; masts will go up like torches- pointy ones- and with the standing rigging gone, if there's anything other than a flat clock- calm those burning masts will roll themselves right out of the ship, off the kelson and through the bottom in short order.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:59 am 
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Micael wrote:
Aha.
Yeah the AG3/AK4 isn't exactly the most convenient rifle in a confined space. Don't you guys use the MP-5 pretty extensively as well? That should be convenient aboard a ship I would imagine.

We stopped using the MP5 a few years ago, replacing it with the MP7A1. Unfortunately, the MP7A1 will shoot through the bulkheads and pretty much anything shipboard, so we're not allowed to have those aboard.

Fortunately, we replaced the AG3 with the HK416 a few years ago though, which does the trick. Especially when it was decided two years ago that the standard issue HK416 with the 14.5" barrel is a tad too long to use aboard, so all ships got the HK416K (10.5" barrel) variant instead. Much easier to carry around inside ships.

As for pistols, yes the AG3-carriers were armed with the P80 (Glock 17) as secondary weapon for when the AG3 was just too big. Accuracy with the P80 at ranges above 5 meters without sufficient marksmanship training (which we didn't have time nor funds for) is... less than nominal. We had shock and hand grenades though :)


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