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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:06 am 
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I'll admit it might be because I 'wasn't there at the time', but watching TNG now I...not just don't find the Borg frightening, I can't. All I see is "hello, I have arrived on your bridge and now I will flop my arms around."

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:45 am 
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The Bushranger wrote:
I'll admit it might be because I 'wasn't there at the time', but watching TNG now I...not just don't find the Borg frightening, I can't. All I see is "hello, I have arrived on your bridge and now I will flop my arms around."


Ha, watch them through the eyes of a 13yo who KNOWS that NCC-1701 is real and you'll be scared.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:26 am 
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Craiglxviii wrote:
The Bushranger wrote:
I'll admit it might be because I 'wasn't there at the time', but watching TNG now I...not just don't find the Borg frightening, I can't. All I see is "hello, I have arrived on your bridge and now I will flop my arms around."


Ha, watch them through the eyes of a 13yo who KNOWS that NCC-1701 is real and you'll be scared.

Something like that :D

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 1:44 am 
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The Bushranger wrote:
I'll admit it might be because I 'wasn't there at the time', but watching TNG now I...not just don't find the Borg frightening, I can't. All I see is "hello, I have arrived on your bridge and now I will flop my arms around."

When the Borg were first introduced, they were legitimately terrifying. A decade later, they had been reduced almost to a punchline. And it's mostly Voyager's fault, or at least the lazy writing staff on ST:Voyager.

After their debut, every subsequent appearance of the Borg showed the audience more about them - over time, this stripped away their mystique (and also exposed just how little thought had actually gone into their initial creation). Instead of a mysterious, implacable force of unknown (perhaps unknowable) power and possessing bizarre abilities, the Borg became a known quantity. Almost old hat. Additionally, many of these later appearances noticeably reduced Borg capabilities compared to BoBW, and thus also reduced the threat the Borg posed: while the first Borg Cube to hit Federation space single-handedly wrecked most of Starfleet, by the end of Voyager's run a single small Federation ship single-handedly wrecked the entire Borg Collective, including uncountable numbers of the "unbeatable" Borg Cubes, with the Borg being unable even to attempt any response.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 3:48 am 
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That's true, but it's still the BoBW Borg that I can't take seriously, primarily because of their appearance.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:14 pm 
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The Borg were an imposing threat to me, one that was all the more interesting because they didn't go out to their way to explain themselves like so many Trek antagonists do. They were an actual alien race for once, not just a human culture with a funny forehead and different customs, one that didn't care about the things we did or anything like it, and all the more so in TNG before the brain bug of assimilation reduced them to being simple bio-technological hive insects.

All say one thing, the Borg Cube trashing Star Fleet at Wolf 359 isn't all that imposing an event when the premire class of Federation capital ship, the Galaxy's, came with a pair of phasers and a handful of forward and rear firing torpedo tubes. They were the equivalent of Dreadnought armed like a peace cruiser, IMO.

The Bushranger wrote:
That's true, but it's still the BoBW Borg that I can't take seriously, primarily because of their appearance.


It was terribly silly in TNG. Unfortunately their face lift came hand in hand with their neutering.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:23 pm 
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Micael wrote:
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The Borg filled in the Klingons after the Ferengi failed. The Cardassians were more a side step seeking to make another antagonist but not one at least equal to the Federation. So much of what we saw involving the Cardassians in TNG was the Fed going out of its way to avoid a war they could win, but still wasn't worth the cost that led them into barely avoiding outright appeasement.

IMO< on its own it was terrible, but given that it receded DS9 and the Dominion War, I find it an awesome middle finger to the spirit in the Federation best represented by Picard that was dangerously naive and weak minded, something with continued to remain relevant.

Yeah it was with the arrival of the Borg that TNG got a proper enemy. I never cared much for the Cardassians, I always felt that a real scifi enemy should pose a terrifying existential threat which I don't think they did.
The Borg and Species 8472 are up there though.

The Romulans came to be the Klingons for TNG. A rewatch of the 3rd season TNG episodes where they appear, namely "The Enemy" and "The Defector," is very fruitful. Throughout TNG, the Romulans are the primary antagonist.

The Borg are completely different. "Q Who?" is one of the most terrifying Trek episodes out there, though it lacks the true horror of the Borg - assimilation. That taps into very deep-seated human fears of loss of autonomy and the one refuge you always have left. It's a very effective trope, from the brainwashing of the 50s, through the Manchurian Candidate, to the Borg and on into Mass Effect, to just cite a few.

Had they not used the Borg in "I, Borg" and "Descent," we'd have been left with a much more terrifying antagonist. While Alice Krieg is a very talented actress, the Borg would have been better without her queen, or the Data/Queen interactions in First Contact. Just leave them as an unknown, unknowable, unfathonable, but remorseless force of ultimate evil.

The Mikeyverses show how you use the Borg.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 3:43 am 
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Johnny Lyle: The Mikeyverses show how you use the Borg.


Thank you, sir. Suffice it to say you ain't seen nothin' yet. 8-)

Mike

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2017 1:19 pm 
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MikeKozlowski wrote:
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Johnny Lyle: The Mikeyverses show how you use the Borg.


Thank you, sir. Suffice it to say you ain't seen nothin' yet. 8-)

Mike

You're using the Borg in the classic horror sense. Men meddling in things they do not understand.

Keep up the good work.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 9:57 pm 
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I did watch the first episode and it was good. I'm still not paying to watch the rest.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:35 am 
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It was - overall - better than I had expected given the news in this thread.
The clumsy political blah-blah is obvious, innane and detracts from the show but if that gets excised to some degree then the show could be quite good.

Since I get it on Netflix and don't have to pay extra I'll probably keep watching.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 1:08 pm 
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Micael wrote:
It was - overall - better than I had expected given the news in this thread.
The clumsy political blah-blah is obvious, innane and detracts from the show but if that gets excised to some degree then the show could be quite good.

Since I get it on Netflix and don't have to pay extra I'll probably keep watching.


I agree with what you have said.

I also have Netflix in the UK, so I will also keep watching.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:21 pm 
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Micael wrote:
It was - overall - better than I had expected given the news in this thread.
The clumsy political blah-blah is obvious, innane and detracts from the show but if that gets excised to some degree then the show could be quite good.

Since I get it on Netflix and don't have to pay extra I'll probably keep watching.

More likely, they will double down.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:37 am 
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When you re-watch it, the WUT? factor gets worse unfortunately. Start a war for no other reason but wops and giggles with limited intel and knowledge of where the Federation is tactically, never mind technologically, just seems retarded
And we are again in a position where it seems the Vulcans have been AGAIN , withholding information from us (and US is the entire Federation now) or, flat-out lying. That's bad enough. Having Sarek Of Vulcan in that position, makes it way worse.
The look is utterly pure JJ-verse. And, they keep insisting its the TOS -verse. But it really isn't . That bit is going to crash and burn eventually. Saying "the crayon is purple" while you using a fountain pen is somewhat retarded. The Klingon look wasn't the end of the world. But having ALL the Klingons look like that, grates against what they had been babbling about for over 6 months
Give a chance to let them kill themselves...


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:41 am 
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Fortunately, we have the Mikeyverse and Mikeyverse Mark II: Electric Boogaloo to provide us quality Trek.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:36 pm 
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Johnnie Lyle wrote:
Fortunately, we have the Mikeyverse and Mikeyverse Mark II: Electric Boogaloo to provide us quality Trek.

Man, the pressure... ;)

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 6:23 am 
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Wow, that was utterly boring. So boring it almost makes The Deuce interesting. Almost.

I recommend you watch the sci fi comedy The Orville instead.

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It was worse than he had expected. It was so incomprehensibly bad that he'd rather watch Pearl Harbor on a constant, never-ending loop than...


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 7:36 pm 
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I've watched episode 3 of Discovery and I'm...not sure what I think. There are some interesting aspects for sure.
The weirdest thing is that it's as if this universe is the Mirror universe. Not so much goody two shoes Starfleet here...

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:33 pm 
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I know what to think: whoever is writing this abomination is a retarded imbecile
Warp Pollen?? A Klingon Shhh-ing a boarding party?? "Breath Prints''?? I almost hit the power switch right there.
It's not Trek. I don't know what the hell it is. But it aint Trek. And anyone persisting its the TOS-verse? Check yourself into a mental hospital. That level of self delusion must be treated, before it turns into full-on psychosis
God almighty... :shock:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:40 pm 
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KenH wrote:
I know what to think: whoever is writing this abomination is a retarded imbecile
Warp Pollen?? A Klingon Shhh-ing a boarding party?? "Breath Prints''?? I almost hit the power switch right there.
It's not Trek. I don't know what the hell it is. But it aint Trek. And anyone persisting its the TOS-verse? Check yourself into a mental hospital. That level of self delusion must be treated, before it turns into full-on psychosis
God almighty... :shock:

Episode four, it is revealed that all events are taking place in the psychotic mind of a patient in Starfleet Medical's psychatric care. ;)

But actually if I continue onwards with the "Mirror Universe" bit, it kind of feels like it's been written to be an intentionally wildly different universe to Star Trek. Which is weird as well.

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